The Nines Comment Thread

Go ahead and watch the other post above but open this post in a separate tab for comments- that way, you can drop insights/comments/questions/pointy jabs here on this post without interrupting the video!

Comments

[bobhyatt]

What- No love for the bob.blog??? :)

[bobhyatt]

Thank you Ann for a 1 point message!!! Whew!

[Troy Sanders]

Looking at Dave's "5 point" process for leadership development. how do you think that jives with the "come and work your way into...." leadership development tradition that you and I come from?

I tend to like Dave's process for it's intentionality and built-in room for growth, but I guess my question is are these different processes, am I misunderstanding the "come and work your way into..." process?

[bobhyatt]

Shoot- Troy, I'm sorry- I didn't really hear Dave too well- I used his technical fail as an excuse for a bathroom break!
COMMENT ANSWER FAIL...

[Aaron]

Troy-
I don't really think so. One of the challenges for apprenticing (or discipling) in such an intentional way is identifying people to invite into the process.The 'come and work your way into...' is such a natural and organic way of seeing the people that may actually grow and produce fruit from an intentional process.

[matybigfro]

was judas a bad leader cos he disobeyed God
does that mean all good leaders never fail God in anyway

[Aaron]

Push back on 'not planning for a move of God, but preparing for the move': is God really going to do a movement in your (my) church, or does he want to get our church into the movement he's already doing? (I'm picturing a river current we get swept up in)

[BC]

I think this is all I've ever heard Furtick speak about: audacious faith.

[BC]

Can we say spiritualization? Wowy...

[bobhyatt]

Interesting to me the trend towards southern churches... Is this where the big show model still works?
Lots of good stuff here- but an interesting dichotomy even in the speakers between the humble and the audacious.

[Troy Sanders]

Bob-
The five points that Dave threw out for a leadership development process were:
- I do, you watch
- I do, you help
- You do, I help
- You do, I watch
- You do, someone else watches

Aaron-
I completely agree that the "come work your way into..." model has a stark advantage in identifying people to bring into the process of leadership development, but I don't know that it's at all the only means for identification. When you have an 18 year old kid who wants to commit their life to vocational ministry, it seems to me that the identification is done. They may require more time in the development process, or even, God forbid, work their way out of the development process at some point, but I wonder if the Church puts too much emphasis on the identification stage and allows that overemphasis to hinder the actual development process?

I guess my chief concern for the "come work your way into..." model of leadership development is that it can be, and unfortunately has been, used as a means of putting people to the back burner. My guess is that this is usually in conjunction with the "get the right people" model where we recruit those who fit our little mold of what a leader looks like, but what ends up being a very real possibility is that people either feel discarded, or are outright discarded. Regardless of whether we are talking about leadership development or not, that is something the Church needs to guard against in my view, but especially in talking about developing the leadership that you're going to need in the future, allowing people to feel discarded shoots everyone in the foot.

I definitely see the value of the "come work your way" model, but I wonder if it doesn't need to be augmented somehow. Then again, I know what my experience has been with this model, and hope that it is truly unique.

[djchuang]

Thank you for being a simulcast site, amidst sombering family matters this week. Lord be with you.

[matybigfro]

I thought Skye Jethani's sesh was spot on