Others weigh in...

... on Pagan Christianity?

(I'm linking to the reviews that are similar in conclusion to mine, mainly to counter the idea that "some", namely me, are taking statements out of context, twisting Frank's words, etc.)

This is a seriously good review by Trevin Wax: "Pagan Christianity, if taken seriously by many Christians, will not lead to a renewal of the church, but to ecclesial amputation - as more and more disenchanted church members abandon their church families in order to seek after the “pure church” of the first century. They will keep chasing the pot at the end of the rainbow, only to find it eludes them because it doesn’t exist."

iMonk makes me laugh: "The sermon is pagan. The book that tells you the sermon is pagan is not. No one should be the designated song leader. Instead, whoever is rude, loud and mentally ill should be allowed to lead. Do not discourage them, as this is hierarchical and pagan.
Restrooms are pagan. Do not use them.
Church should have no hierarchy at all. Please invite me to your conference where I won’t say this, or anything else.
All routine in worship is wrong. In fact, follow the following suggestions to be truly Christian:

-Meet on different days of the week, and don’t tell anyone when.

-The same with where you meet. Keep ‘em looking.

-Don’t use the Bible more than once every few weeks.

-Try out another religion entirely every so often, to break the routine.

Marriage is also pagan. Avoid it.

Parenting is a hierarchy. In fact, so is child care of any sort. Jesus said let the children come onto me, so get them into your meetings.

All of Paul’s commands to Timothy about the duties of pastors will be explained in a forthcoming, revolutionary, non-hierarchical book.

Your objections to my wisdom are traditional and pagan. As are you. And your little dog."

Bill Kinnon gives "a response to Frank's writing style. He writes as a "true believer." The house church movement is the "right way" to do church and everything else is the wrong way. Let me be blunt. I find the writing style grating and arrogant. And even after losing my affection for the megachurch world a number of years ago, I still found Frank's style off-putting. That style is alive and well in PC."

Joe Thorn here, here and here  (This is awesome: "I do not want to dismiss the authors’ concerns, but it’s hard for me to take them seriously when they so grossly overstate things.Don’t get me wrong. I enjoy provocative books. I want others to challenge me and force me to re-think my practices and beliefs. The problem for me is that the book reads more like an ecclesiological version of the Loose Change conspiracy theories concerning the 9/11 attack. A lot of information is collected, assumptions are made, and in the end the final interpretation of history is simply wrong. Not only does their attempt to uncover the truth fail, but more importantly I fear their legit concerns will be ignored by many while others will read the book as gospel because it presents itself as unquestionable history with Barna’s research seal of approval.")

Len Hjalmerson says in the comments to this post: "In the end, I wish this book would go away. No disrespect to Frank, George, yourself and endorsers, some of whom I know and love. I’m not convinced that polemic is all that helpful within this conversation around the gospel and culture. I would rather have careful and respectful dialogue. I fear that the approach Frank and George have taken, broad and sweeping statements.. will only create bad feelings and division."

Darryl Dash: "Barna and Viola have raised some valid issues. Some dynamics of church life that should be present often aren't. We need to take these seriously. But they don't make their case, and their conclusion ultimately falls short. There is room for all kinds of churches, including the institutional. What matters more than structure is the life contained within, and that can come only from God- who, it seems, is more than willing to give us that life."

Comments

[josh]

i swear i'm not trying to link whore myself out. it feels like it to me since i've left about 15 comments. but we've got our podcast with him up. and i used some of your pushbacks. feel free to listen.

[Bob Hyatt]

No problem at all- I'll post this in the morning.. but now to bed!

[Joey Davis]

I have really struggled lately with my history in church, leadership, ministering, etc. I believe that the holy water of pure religion has been muddied by religiousity and misguided piety. Where can sinners truly go to wash the daily filth from their flesh? In need of a virgin spring..... Can there ever be a source of water outside ones hiding place?